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Slardar, the Slithereen Guard


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#41 Dky

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Posted 30 August 2008 - 11:14 AM

QUOTE(nighthawk911 @ Aug 30 2008, 07:08 PM) View Post

Sorry but... my eyes are burning... mind changing the colors? I can't see anything.

nope I will not change any color.. your screen must be absolutely crap because many people told me that my color layout is really cool.

#42 BWD-Dna

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Posted 31 August 2008 - 12:38 PM

What about midas ?
I think its kinda missing in the guide as i think its a nice option on him in certain games.

#43 doppelpils

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Posted 31 August 2008 - 12:53 PM

You're not gonna farm the whole game. You need Treads asap. You definitly want some stats at the beginning. No, don't get midas.

#44 Dky

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Posted 31 August 2008 - 04:16 PM

QUOTE(doppelpils @ Aug 31 2008, 10:53 PM) View Post

You're not gonna farm the whole game. You need Treads asap. You definitly want some stats at the beginning. No, don't get midas.

QFT smile.gif

My items are just essential and must not be delayed.

#45 chow again

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Posted 02 September 2008 - 09:44 AM

I have a question regarding deso as not a core item.

Nowadays it is common for heroes to get HoTD and armlet, which gives 10 armor, add in the inevitable vlad/meka armor aura thats another 5. at lvl 18-25, most str or agi carries have around 8-12 natural armor, so it is safe to say that most carries have around at least 20-25 armor. They might have even more with various armor buffs which are getting common.

Now, at 25armor a hero has exactly 60% reduction. With amplify dmg+deso buff, it brings him down to 4 armor which is round 15% reduction. throw in a teamates AC or stg, it goes down to -1.

lets say you deal 100 dmg per hit. with 60% reduction which is common on both str and agi carries you can only deal 40 dmg per hit. if you manage a amplify+deso+AC reduction on him, it brings him down to -1, but for convinience sake lets put it at 0. now you deal EXACTLY 100 dmg on him per hit.

lets check it out. 60% reduction you deal 40 dmg, 0% reduction you deal 100. thats like 2.5 crit EVERYTIME FOR EVERYONE. Even for a troll warlord farmed up with bkb(doesnt remove amplify), he isnt going to last long.with everyone dealing 2.5 times dmg every time on him.

you might say that the -6 is not important. on the contrary, i say its crucial. you see the aim is not to reduce it to negative armor, it is to get it to exactly 0. int heroes dont matter, they dont have such high armor, but late game, their tankability isnt an issue. it is those buffed up carries that matter the most. painting them with amplify and reducing it further with deso+AC will make them go down very fast.

lets compare a carry hit by amplify+AC and amplify+deso+AC, with 100 dmg dealed as the hypothetical situation

1st : -20 armor, the carry still has 5 armor left, it grants him 20% reduction, which increases the dmg from 40 to 80
2nd : -25 armor, the carry has 0 armor left, 0% reduction, increases the dmg from 40 to 100. see the difference now? from a +40 dmg to a +60 increase.virtually a 50% increase on bonus dmg. on ALL 5 HEROES focusing on him. thats a lot.

i know this gives him less hp then the armlet build, I am not asking all of you to skip the armlet part, just instead of getting HoTD, get vlads, or even better a teamate gets it, in preparation for the deso orb. bracers and bkb is inevitable. dont skip it.

comparing vlad and HoTD, both gives almost the same amount of lifesteal, and armor+5, vlad gives bonus mana regen(ok maybe abit wasted). HoTD creeps arent really usefull on slardar, since with sprint he is so mobile, creeps cant catch up easily. and vlad's auras make up for that in teambattles.

so why not go vlads, and complete whatever you want, armlet/bkb/hood, stuff you would have gotten anyway. and complete the build with deso?IMO, its superior to satanic anyway.

Lastly dont forget about the team element, vlad gives a BUNCH of auras, while everyone benefits from deso. perhaps it might be overkill on int heroes, in that case dont get it, but to combat a farmed up carry, i think its worth it.

thoughts?




#46 Dky

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Posted 02 September 2008 - 12:51 PM

you basically completely explain why deso can be interesting in late game... but you somewhat forget those points:
1/ enemy's carries don't always end up having so much armor
2/ your allies can also get deso, thus you can go for hp sometimes
3/ same for vlad

this is why deso isn't mandatory in my build, but only an option.. it's all about being able to adapt to the game imho

on top of that HP are absolutely needed... ofc it's interesting to have more damages, but it's completely useless if it basically prevent you from doing your job (chasing). If you have a too big dmg output you will end up being focused, which will prevent you from chasing efficiently... slardar need, for that reason, to balance his dmg / hp ratio in favor of his hp pool, even if it's only slighty. On the other hand many others heroes can do the opposite and increase their dmg without a good hp compensation: those heroes should carry deso

Edited by Dky, 02 September 2008 - 01:05 PM.


#47 stillmissyou

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Posted 06 September 2008 - 10:49 PM

i cant fkin see anything ?

#48 nekdolan

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Posted 07 September 2008 - 12:45 AM

use DA skin maybe  tongue.gif !?

#49 Warchief-Daniel

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Posted 13 September 2008 - 08:54 AM

Very nice guide indeed, finaly a league player that supports a "noob" build! tongue.gif ^^

I use almost exactly the same build, although I like getting a HotD after armlet. Usually I get 2 HoIWs early and 2 circlets, since creeps do alot of dmg early game when you sprint chase and thus the armor from two helms help alot, and the regen is very nice when you are "relaxing" in the lane after a gank/teambattle.

Also, for me Slardar has another role included to those you mentioned: He is a "hidden" treath. Most people don't see him doing that much dmg alone, but with armlet + AD around mid game, you can easily take out their squishy heroes alone in a team battle. I remember once (in a pub though) when I was Slardar with "only" 2 bracers, Armlet, Treads and HotD and I managed to AD a sniper in mid lane who was with tiny, sprint in, stun them both and kill sniper and run away before tiny could do a thing. Although that was a pub game, it sorta shows how imba his dps can be with teammates with disables. Also, he does great mindgames. I took on a balanar at night with those same items at lvl 20 with only 15% hp, and killed him. Ofcourse, carefully using Armlet was needed and again it was a pub (I don't really have time to play serious so it's mostly pubs I play).

Anyways, to conclude: With Armlet + AD + Sprint + Crush, he can do a hell of a lot of dmg and be gone again unless their team focuses him high. And if you get away with 5-10% hp, you can hang around near the battle and re-appear in an appropriat time.

#50 Rave-

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Posted 15 September 2008 - 12:48 PM

QUOTE(Dky @ Aug 31 2008, 08:14 AM) View Post

nope I will not change any color.. your screen must be absolutely crap because many people told me that my color layout is really cool.

Nice colours indeed even though I was using Aerobase and had to go back to DA skin. It's that easy peeps. lol.

Btw great guide.

#51 wreon

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Posted 23 September 2008 - 10:28 PM

Excellent guide!

You use the exact build I use for him, armlet was practically made for him. Nothing much to say here, just that I agree with your build completely haha. Damn this is boring. wink.gif

#52 ffrog1

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Posted 27 September 2008 - 02:06 AM

ok i am loving this guide and i am using it to dominate at school.
I am unsure though about 1 thing how to use Armlett of morgidian? Do i use the abiility whenever possible? When i am chasing or in team battles? not at all?

thanks for any responses

#53 Dky

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Posted 27 September 2008 - 04:27 AM

QUOTE(ffrog1 @ Sep 27 2008, 11:06 AM) View Post
ok i am loving this guide and i am using it to dominate at school.
I am unsure though about 1 thing how to use Armlett of morgidian? Do i use the abiility whenever possible? When i am chasing or in team battles? not at all?

thanks for any responses

Yes, use it whenever it is possible smile.gif

Just be carefull with the degeneration when you chase... if you know that you are not going to catch your target quickly just turn it off (unless you are really low on hp... but in this case you'd be better to back).


#54 ffrog1

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Posted 27 September 2008 - 11:27 AM

ok i am still confused about how it works is there a thread on it i aint found one on the mechanics section.

#55 Dky

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Posted 27 September 2008 - 12:53 PM

QUOTE(ffrog1 @ Sep 27 2008, 09:27 PM) View Post
ok i am still confused about how it works is there a thread on it i aint found one on the mechanics section.

Just check Paccmoi's guide to Armlet smile.gif


#56 Ghettobrook

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Posted 10 October 2008 - 03:06 PM

Congrats on getting premiumed

#57 ZeratuL-

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Posted 18 October 2008 - 12:33 PM

very nice guild.

i usually go same build with armlet but usually go MoM  to just dominate 1v1 battles n chase right afterwards u say its a bad idea i guess it is better to go for ac/hear or bkb depending on the situation.

#58 cefe

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Posted 20 October 2008 - 12:34 AM

Good work. Very nice guide. I would like to point out that Slardar with a Helm of Dominator in early and mid-game could be deadly if the user has some average micro skills. I like getting Helm of Iron Will for the HP regen + Armor, which helps me to farm better in early then finishing my Helm of Dominator. Inmediatly get a Centaur or Fulbort to assist me killing enemy heroes. Getting a couple Centaurs "2 Stun (2 sec each)" + Slardar's Slithereen Crush creates a Stun lock + Bash (with some luck) + Sprint (if they survive) biggrin.gif
Again, great work..keep it up happy.gif

cefe

#59 rion89

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Posted 20 October 2008 - 07:52 AM

quick question on the skill build.. if you straight out maxxed sprint and rush.. i was wondering, why not put even just (1) level of bash? like.. bash>sprint>crush>crush>sprint/crush>ult>then go max sprint crush? OR keep sprint at lvl 3 early game to save more points for crush, then max out bash. 30%ms is already a lot, almost enough to ensure that you land that crush on fleeing heroes.. just my $0.02

#60 doppelpils

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Posted 20 October 2008 - 03:55 PM

First: Great guide. This exactly how to build and play Slardar. The only thing i don't quite agree is the Bottle isssue. With Sprint you have very good access to runes and it allows you to use your spells a little more often. And having a double damage in your pocket is just plain retarded on Slardar. You can two-hit low armor heroes with it. But meh, thats nothing to nag about.

Second: Maybe something you might add for .56 is Magic Stick. Slardar is imo one of the best users from Magic Stick. I sometimes run out of Mana, especially after long chases and fights and the Stick is just exactly the amount Slardar needs for regen.




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