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Ingolf's guide to Mirana the Priestess of the Moon


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#21 -Might-

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Posted 03 May 2008 - 01:36 AM

As u say, we rely on stun whan ganking BUT, u have to farm creeps too. U cant farm with Elune's arrow, unlike with Starfall. for ganks lvl1 Arrow is enough, cuz the stun lenght is the same on lvl1 and on lvl4 so lvl1 stun is enough for ganks, but as i said, i think Potm is a carry agi hero and very itemdependant at mid-late and late-game, so have to farm well in early and mid-game, thats why i max Starfall first.

Edited by MightyDraenei, 03 May 2008 - 01:36 AM.


#22 DeathMusician

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Posted 03 May 2008 - 02:01 AM

You rely on the stun-true. However, you rely on the stun not for the damage, but for a long stun duration. To each individual, stun does 60 more magicial damage, which after resistance is factored in, a mere 45 damage. After you leap in to Starfall, you can easily pull off another 2 hits with your movement speed bonus.

Also, the AoE damage cannot be discounted. It could mean a double kill. Even if it doesn't take out 2 enemies, you will probably force the other to back off.

Edited by DeathMusician, 03 May 2008 - 02:02 AM.


#23 Beast_Pete

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Posted 03 May 2008 - 02:48 AM

I agree with maxing starfall and having only one level on arrow in early game. Justifications were given by the other people. But anyway, your guide is quite good so keep up the good work. smile.gif

#24 mal-f(x)

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Posted 05 May 2008 - 07:01 AM

You underestimate the damage PotM does with Stygian Desolator. The Skadi/Mjoll build takes forever to build and its benefits can be felt only in the later stages of the game. Stygian complements her ganking abilities and gives her a lot of physical damage to go with the burst damage of her spells. A new build which advocates Bottle > BoT > Midas > Stygian Desolator > Butterfly is becoming very popular. One other advantage of this build is that your team can completely forgo the carry hero, since you are more than enough. SK.Djan (aka Smile aka ARS-ART) has been using this build a lot. Also check out SGC.necRo's PotM with the aforementioned build in SGC vs x6 in MYM Pride 10. (He ends up out carrying a fully farmed Luna)

Regarding the skill build, I disagree maxing Arrow over starfall. A solo PotM is very popular in all forms of the game and arrow does nothing to help you in those situations. Even in a dual lane, starfall is much better since your chances of hitting an arrow is always uncertain. I prefer the build -

Leap
Arrow
Starfall
Starfall
Starfall
...

#25 noob-tsuki

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Posted 06 May 2008 - 05:29 AM

nice guide. i just reckon when it comes to using your arrow, it only comes natural. i agree with the arrow shot at death prophet where you do predict where the enemy is moving. i don't know how you could predict where the enemy is going, especially while they have haste, but nice...the meeeeanest shot

#26 IDeadshotI

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Posted 06 May 2008 - 06:45 AM

I like the style and presentation of your guide alot. Thumbs up for the Elune's Arrow guide too, although it is more or less instinctive to the experienced player it also helps enlighten newbies.

I would like to state my view that I agree with maxing Arrow first - in a more serious game, PoTM's role is first as a ganker, then as a carry - being a carry comes second. Starfall early game is not a spammable skill, due to its high mana cost, over-pushing capabalities (which is unadvisable - no one likes ganking tower-hugging opponents), and also leaves you with no disable to chase enemies with, while doing less damage than arrow. Last hitting is also more reliable than using Starfall to farm when you barely have the mana to support it in the first place.


#27 shinich111

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Posted 07 May 2008 - 09:56 AM

You can pretty much alternate Skadi and Mjolnir depending on the game situation, but if you are planning to make both then a point booster does offer an excellent gold for hp/mana cost ratio.


#28 veilsideRX7

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Posted 10 May 2008 - 06:40 AM

for a new guide something really should be said about orchid
overall its a good guide but it says the same things as all the other guides that have already been made
i think a newly written guide should be more up to date

my opinion on arrow vs starfall...
starfall should be taken over arrow when:
at higher lvl when opponents can dodge, starfall should be taken over arrow. also they would be warding the river, or even just keeping an eye on the minimap, and would be able to be aware of you coming for a gank.
also starfall should be taken in a 1v2 situation nearly always. dont really think i need to explain... stun on 1 hero is useless anyway when there is another hero nearby who will be hitting u. and when the stun runs out, there will be 2 heroes, both hitting u...

but i think arrow should be taken over starfall in pubs, they cant really dodge, they dont really know the timing when a good potm will look to arrow them, map awareness/gank awareness is low, warding is unlikely, but mostly cos arrow is more fun then starfall and pubs are for fun. (also heroes like riki, clinkz, and bounty get chosen alot in pubs, and when a hero like that is chosen, i am always going to max arrow asap so when they try to run away i can shoot them in the a$$ biggrin.gif

Edited by veilsideRX7, 13 May 2008 - 02:44 AM.


#29 Overflow_GR

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Posted 14 May 2008 - 01:23 PM

As weird as this may sound, I'm gonna recommend that you add HoM to your "Items not to buy" list. I recently played a game where I first-blooded, had total control over my lane and 1950 gold in about 8 minutes, so I bought HoM.

It backfired badly. I fell into the trap of visiting high level camps in jungle and missing some incredible ganking opportunities early on. sad.gif

I'm glad you included Orchid as a possibility. smile.gif I wouldn't consider it for the cookie cutter build, as Skadi covers mana nicely. But I like doing 2 Wraiths - Boots - Bottle - Sobi - Desolator - Oblivion Staff - Travel - HoT - Orchid.

#30 skydivingmonkey

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Posted 14 May 2008 - 06:37 PM

effective build, not original or anything but it works

personally, i would go with arcane ring over bottle. this allows great farming with BOT and starfall. except for rune bottling, i think that bottle is not too useful because it regenerates little mana, doesn't expand your mana pool, and is unnessasary in escapes because of your leap and ulti.

#31 GoLd3nRat1o

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Posted 15 May 2008 - 05:48 AM

I prefer maxing arrow early because of the good damage boost especially when ganking. It needs less mana to use and if your good at an arrow you find that the damage dealt when maxxed is really good as compared to starfall. Besides its way too mana consuming too. Easy harassments can be made through arrow+hits because of stun duration.

I disagree in getting BoT early because most towers should be still up and tele scrolls can easily cover the mobility of BoT early-mid. You can get stygian or maelstorm first and then go for the BoT. A rushed stygian/maelstorm can deal lots of damage early too, coupled with the awesome spells.

Nice guide!

#32 Thoth-

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Posted 15 May 2008 - 08:53 PM

Nice guide, I'll use it.

#33 were_wolf_fang

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Posted 16 May 2008 - 06:35 AM

Nice guide, and excellent work on the arrow section.


#34 Fading Light

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Posted 16 May 2008 - 06:14 PM

The only difference in your skill build and mine is I max leap (not elune's arrow) once I've maxed starfall.

#35 VaKe_VK

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Posted 17 May 2008 - 12:01 AM

good guide^^
Can someone tell me when to use the Fast and Furios build and when the cookie cutter?

Edited by VaKe_VK, 17 May 2008 - 12:44 AM.


#36 Keritzel

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Posted 19 May 2008 - 04:25 AM

Brilliant piece of work. I prefer Elune's arrow over Starfall though, mainly because if you are skilled enough, arrow wins starfall due to its superior range.

#37 Ingolf

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Posted 19 May 2008 - 08:45 AM

QUOTE(VaKe_VK @ May 17 2008, 09:01 AM) View Post

good guide^^
Can someone tell me when to use the Fast and Furios build and when the cookie cutter?

It's much a question of preference. I usually build the fast and furious if the game seems to be "rather" short, which would in my mind be around 60 minutes. If I intend to farm a lot (almost all the time) during the early- and middle game, I tend to go the cookie cutter. However, it's often very hard to tell so you'd basically just make up your mind before you start the game.

#38 hofodomo01

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Posted 19 May 2008 - 11:44 PM

Pretty nice, I love the screenshots you used to show various arrow situations.  Though I have bad mana issues using both arrow and starfall sad.gif

#39 UTDC.Justin

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Posted 29 May 2008 - 07:17 AM

Good job on taking the advice and being welcome to criticism; I think you will find that after personally testing stuff like that, there can be some small changes to be made. The earlier Starfall provides some laning ability/harassment as well, sometimes important when you are up against a troublesome hero.

Also, more information in replays would be really nice (something simple like where u laned + lineup)

So I'm pretty glad that you made those small changes, because it probably pays off for the players who read this guide and for yourself in the future ^^

Edited by Justin Kong, 29 May 2008 - 07:23 AM.


#40 Ingolf

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Posted 29 May 2008 - 08:56 AM

I might not be responding to everything in my threads but I always read the post and take most criticisms up to reconsideration. Many of them are mostly trashed (let's say someone wanted to guy Blademails on Mirana) but some of them might also be quite useful, so don't think I will never change my guides if someone convinces me of something else/new happy.gif. As a minimum I always listen passively in the background while people discuss the topic. If I feel the urge to jump in, I will.




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